Astronet > Forumy > Obsuzhdenie publikacii Astroneta > Himicheskie osnovy vozniknoveniya Zhizni

D. A. Aleksandrov, M. B. Gottih · 23.01.2003 19:29

Priroda zhizni, raznoobrazie zhivyh sushestv, ob'edinyayushaya ih strukturnaya i funkcional'naya blizost' vsegda privlekali k sebe osoboe vnimanie. No v predele vse eti voprosy svodilis' k glavnomu - zagadke proishozhdeniya zhizni, na Zemle i vo Vselennoi.
>> Prochitat' stat'yu

A. M. Nesh · 3.03.2003 2:03

davaite rassmotrim konkretnyi belok, a imenno GEMOGLOBIN kak naibolee izuchennyi. Citata 1): Molekula gemoglobina sostoit iz chetyreh sub'edinic: dvuh a i dvuh b - i sootvetstvenno soderzhit chetyre polipeptidnye cepochki dvuh sortov. Kazhdaya a-cepochka soderzhit 141, a b-cepochka - 146 aminokislotnyh ostatkov. Takim obrazom, vsya molekula gemoglobina vklyuchaet 574 aminokisloty. Hotya aminokislotnye posledovatel'nosti a- i b-cepochek razlichny, oni imeyut prakticheski odinakovye tretichnye prostranstvennye struktury. Sobstvenno govorya, privedennye vyshe detali struktury otnosyatsya ne k gemoglobinu, a k ego belkovoi komponente - globinu. Kazhdaya sub'edinica gemoglobina soderzhit odnu nebelkovuyu (tak nazyvaemuyu prosteticheskuyu) gruppu - gem. Gem predstavlyaet soboi kompleks Fe(II) s protoporfirinom. (GEMOGLOBIN, L. A. BLYuMENFEL'D, Moskovskii gosudarstvennyi universitet im. M.V. Lomonosova) http://www.pereplet.ru/obrazovanie/stsoros/526.html Citata 2): Serpovidno-kletochnaya anemiya Naibolee chastaya forma gemoglobinopatii, vstrechaetsya u lic negroidnoi rasy, obuslovlena nalichiem u bol'nogo gemoglobina S, kotoryi otlichaetsya ot gemoglobina A zdorovyh lyudei zamenoi odnoi aminokisloty v b -cepi, a imenno valina vmesto glyutaminovoi kisloty. Eto privodit k umen'sheniyu rastvorimosti gemoglobina S po sravneniyu s gemoglobinom A bolee chem v 100 raz i razvitiyu v svyazi s etim fenomena serpovidnosti. Eritrocity serpovidnoi formy stanovyatsya bolee rigidnymi i "zastrevayut" v kapillyarah. Eto privodit k razvitiyu trombozov v raznyh organah. http://www.soros.karelia.ru/projects/1998/diagnostika/gemato/razdel4/razdel4_9_2.htm Citata 3): Vo-pervyh, stali izvestny molekulyarnye massy belkov, lezhashie po ocenkam v intervale 10 - 2000 tys. D. (Teper' takie molekuly nazyvayut makromolekulami.) Vo-vtoryh, bylo pokazano, chto raznye belki raspadayutsya na aminokisloty ne menee 17 tipov (v dal'neishem - 20). Esli predstavit' sebe, chto belki - lineinye molekuly, a po rentgenostrukturnym dannym lineinyi razmer aminokislot okolo 0.003 mkm, to lineinye cepochki vsego iz 100 zven'ev sostavyat uzhe 0.3 mkm, chto vpolne sopostavimo s vidimymi razmerami hromosom i kletochnogo yadra (3 - 10 mkm). http://vivovoco.rsl.ru/VV/PAPERS/NATURE/GENECODE.HTM Kak vidno iz citaty 1) informacionnaya emkost' gemoglobina ravna 574*3 = 1722 bit (odna aminokislota kodiruetsya 3 bitami). Kak vidno iz citaty 2) nepravil'noe znachenie odnogo bita zamenyaet tip aminokisloty (glutamin na valin), chto privodit k katastroficheskim posledstviyam. Togda nado vybrat' iz sluchainyh variantov belka, kotoryh budet 2 v stepeni 1772 = 2.661 na 10 v stepeni 533, tol'ko odin! Pust' proverka dlit'sya vremya, kotoroe nuzhno schityvatelyu dvizhushemusya so skorost'yu sveta (!), chtoby probezhat' 574 aminokisloty razmerom 0.003 mkm (sm. Citatu 3). Obshaya dlina cepei sostavit 0.003 mkm * 574 = 1.772 na 10 v minus 6-i stepeni metrov. A vremya schityvaniya Sostavit 1.772 na 10 minus 6-i (metrov)/ 300 na 10 v 6-i (metrov/sek.) = 5.74 na 10 v minus 15-i sekund. Togda vremya vybora = kol-vo variantov * vremya schityvaniya = 4.845 na 10 v stepeni 502 mlrd. let!!!! A ved' eto tol'ko odin belok trebuet takogo vremeni, a skol'ko zhe ponadobit'sya na sintez kletki, soderzhashei okolo 2000 tipov belkov?

A. M. Nesh · 6.03.2003 16:07

oNYaShKYuCh EYE PYuG RNR FE RE'YaR, OPHMEYaEMMShI HG Word-97, MYu OPNAS ON bYu'EI OPNYaEAE. DYuBYuIRE PYuYaYaLNRPHL 'NM'PERMShI AEKN', Yu HLEMMN celncknahm 'Yu' MYuHANKEE HGSVEMMShI. zhHRYuRYu 1): lNKE'SKYu CELNCKNAHMYu YaNYaRNHR HG VERShPEU YaSAZEDHMHZh: DBSU a H DBSU b - H YaNNRBERYaRBEMMN YaNDEPFHR VERShPE ONKHOEORHDMShE ZhEONV'H DBSU YaNPRNB. iYuFDYu' a-ZhEONV'Yu YaNDEPFHR 141, Yu b-ZhEONV'Yu - 146 YuLHMN'HYaKNRMShU NYaRYuR'NB. rYu'HL NAPYuGNL, BYa' LNKE'SKYu CELNCKNAHMYu B'KChVYuER 574 YuLHMN'HYaKNRSh. uNR' YuLHMN'HYaKNRMShE ONYaKEDNBYuREKEMNYaRH a- H b-ZhEONVE' PYuGKHVMSh, NMH HLEChR OPYu'RHVEYa'H NDHMYu'NBShE RPERHVMShE OPNYaRPYuMYaRBEMMShE YaRPS'RSPSh. yaNAYaRBEMMN CNBNP', OPHBEDEMMShE BSh'E DERYuKH YaRPS'RSPSh NRMNYa'RYa' ME ' CELNCKNAHMS, Yu ' ECN AEK'NBNI 'NLONMEMRE - CKNAHMS. iYuFDYu' YaSAZEDHMHZhYu CELNCKNAHMYu YaNDEPFHR NDMS MEAEK'NBSCh (RYu' MYuGShBYuELSCh OPNYaRERHVEYa'SCh) CPSOOS - CEL. cEL OPEDYaRYuBK'ER YaNANI 'NLOKE'Ya Fe(II) Ya OPNRNONPTHPHMNL. (celncknahm, k. yu. akchlemteked, lNYa'NBYa'HI CNYaSDYuPYaRBEMMShI SMHBEPYaHRER HL. l.b. kNLNMNYaNBYu) http://www.pereplet.ru/obrazovanie/stsoros/526.html zhHRYuRYu 2): yaEPONBHDMN-'KERNVMYu' YuMELH' mYuHANKEE VYuYaRYu' TNPLYu CELNCKNAHMNOYuRHI, BYaRPEVYuERYa' S KHZh MECPNHDMNI PYuYaSh, NASYaKNBKEMYu MYuKHVHEL S ANKEMNCN CELNCKNAHMYu S, 'NRNPShI NRKHVYuERYa' NR CELNCKNAHMYu yu GDNPNBShU KChDEI GYuLEMNI NDMNI YuLHMN'HYaKNRSh B b -ZhEOH, Yu HLEMMN BYuKHMYu BLEYaRN CKChRYuLHMNBNI 'HYaKNRSh. shRN OPHBNDHR ' SLEME'EMHCh PYuYaRBNPHLNYaRH CELNCKNAHMYu S ON YaPYuBMEMHCh Ya CELNCKNAHMNL yu ANKEE VEL B 100 PYuG H PYuGBHRHCh B YaB'GH Ya ShRHL TEMNLEMYu YaEPONBHDMNYaRH. shPHRPNZhHRSh YaEPONBHDMNI TNPLSh YaRYuMNB'RYa' ANKEE PHCHDMShLH H "GYuYaRPEBYuChR" B 'YuOHKK'PYuU. shRN OPHBNDHR ' PYuGBHRHCh RPNLANGNB B PYuGMShU NPCYuMYuU. http://www.soros.karelia.ru/projects/1998/diagnostika/gemato/razdel4/razdel4_9_2.htm zhHRYuRYu 3): bN-OEPBShU, YaRYuKH HGBEYaRMSh LNKE'SK'PMShE LYuYaYaSh AEK'NB, KEFYuYHE ON NZhEM'YuL B HMREPBYuKE 10 - 2000 RShYa. d. (rEOEPE RYu'HE LNKE'SKSh MYuGShBYuChR LYu'PNLNKE'SKYuLH.) bN-BRNPShU, AShKN ON'YuGYuMN, VRN PYuGMShE AEK'H PYuYaOYuDYuChRYa' MYu YuLHMN'HYaKNRSh ME LEMEE 17 RHONB (B DYuKEMEI'EL - 20). eYaKH OPEDYaRYuBHRE YaEAE, VRN AEK'H - KHMEIMShE LNKE'SKSh, Yu ON PEMRCEMNYaRPS'RSPMShL DYuMMShL KHMEIMShI PYuGLEP YuLHMN'HYaKNR N'NKN 0.003 L'L, RN KHMEIMShE ZhEONV'H BYaECN HG 100 GBEMEEB YaNYaRYuB'R SFE 0.3 L'L, VRN BONKME YaNONYaRYuBHLN Ya BHDHLShLH PYuGLEPYuLH UPNLNYaNL H 'KERNVMNCN 'DPYu (3 - 10 L'L). http://vivovoco.rsl.ru/VV/PAPERS/NATURE/GENECODE.HTM iYu' BHDMN HG ZhHRYuRSh 1) HMTNPLYuZhHNMMYu' EL'NYaRE CELNCKNAHMYu PYuBMYu 574*3 = 1722 AHR (NDMYu YuLHMN'HYaKNRYu 'NDHPSERYa' 3 AHRYuLH). iYu' BHDMN HG ZhHRYuRSh 2) MEOPYuBHKEMNE GMYuVEMHE NDMNCN AHRYu GYuLEM'ER RHO YuLHMN'HYaKNRSh (CKSRYuLHM MYu BYuKHM), VRN OPHBNDHR ' 'YuRYuYaRPNTHVEYa'HL ONYaKEDYaRBH'L. rNCDYu MYuDN BShAPYuRE HG YaKSVYuIMShU BYuPHYuMRNB AEK'Yu, 'NRNPShU ASDER 2 B YaREOEMH 1772 = 2.661 MYu 10 B YaREOEMH 533, RNKE'N NDHM! oSYaRE OPNBEP'Yu DKHREYa' BPEL', 'NRNPNE MSFMN YaVHRShBYuREKCh DBHFSYELSYa' YaN Ya'NPNYaRECh YaBERYu (!), VRNASh OPNAEFYuRE 574 YuLHMN'HYaKNRSh PYuGLEPNL 0.003 L'L (YaL. zhHRYuRS 3). nAYYu' DKHMYu ZhEOEI YaNYaRYuBHR 0.003 L'L * 574 = 1.772 MYu 10 B LHMSYa 6-I YaREOEMH LERPNB. yu BPEL' YaVHRShBYuMH' yaNYaRYuBHR 1.772 MYu 10 LHMSYa 6-I (LERPNB)/ 300 MYu 10 B 6-I (LERPNB/YaE'.) = 5.74 MYu 10 B LHMSYa 15-I YaE'SMD. rNCDYu BPEL' BShANPYu = 'NK-BN BYuPHYuMRNB * BPEL' YaVHRShBYuMH' = 4.845 MYu 10 B YaREOEMH 502 LKPD. KER!!!! yu BEDE ShRN RNKE'N NDHM AEKN' RPEASER RYu'NCN BPELEMH, Yu Ya'NKE'N FE ONMYuDNAHREYa' MYu YaHMREG 'KER'H, YaNDEPFYuYEI N'NKN 2000 RHONB AEK'NB?